Podcast: Download (6.6MB)
Subscribe: RSS
Podcast (podcast-mp3): Download (5.9MB)
Subscribe: RSS
What I Have to Give
Episode #456
August 30, 2015
With Martha Kilpatrick and hosted by John Enslow
Special Guest: Jennifer Wentzel
This is the continuation of a series of Podcasts started in Episode #453.
(J) Maybe the push for the external is more evidence of the depth that someone’s willing to go with Him. Maybe if I’m wanting everything to be external; “Show me miracles outside of me.” “Show me great worship outside of me.” “Give me a wonderful show, God.” Maybe that is more about the person’s commitment and evidence of the fact that they don’t want it inside. Maybe that’s, maybe it’s a… You know what I’m saying? Maybe they’re saying, “Ok, here, no further. Don’t go beyond my barrier, God.” And when it comes… See, you’re going to lose everything. When it comes inside of you, that’s when it’s going to touch everything. That’s when you’re going to lose everything. As long as I can keep it on an external basis, “Woo hoo,” I could just party out here, “Yaayyy! Don’t touch me. Don’t you dare touch me. Yaayyy!” You know? And, but when I have to, when I have to grapple with it, it’s the Bride. It’s the difference between the nominal and the daughters of Jerusalem and the Shulamite and the Bride. That’s the difference is, “Am I going to let it come in and wreck me, inside me? Am I going to let, am I going to be affected by His cross? Am I going to have to say no?” Does that make any sense?
(Jennifer) That is Martha’s booklet, The Power of Decision. That is the nutshell of what she’s driving at is our power to shut to the door. God-given free will is respected by God. So, here I’m going to say something that is crazy-blunt, alright? And I don’t mean this to be mean, because it’s the most encouraging thing in the world. You have the relationship with God that you have chosen, so if your life is kind of dead, if you don’t hear Him, if He’s not there, that’s because you chose that. Now, that doesn’t account for times when we’re in the wilderness and there are these things certainly. It’s not a blanket. I’m not proclaiming judgment on anybody, but we have the choice. That’s the difference between auto-bots and human beings and companionship and fellowship with the Lord. He did free will for that purpose, so that it would be an actual love relationship and not the equivalent of a man and his dog.
(M) Jennifer, I met Major Ian Thomas one time. Several times I heard him speak at our church. And I understood; I had gotten the essence that Christ in you, He lives your life. But I went up to him and said, “I have the revelation.” He said, “No, you have Him.” And it frustrated me. “Yeah, yeah, yeah, ok, I have Him,” but it was significant. I have the revelation. And he gave the right answer, though I didn’t like it. Then I said, “I’ve got it. I’ve got Him, Ok, but I don’t know how to live it moment by moment.” He said, “Hee hee, you can have as much of Him as you want.” And that frustrated me no end, because I wanted Him deeply, and I wanted His presence. I wanted that love affair that I had known and tasted. And I wanted His life instead of mine, but it was my choice. He put it right back on me every time. So, I can affirm what you’re saying, by Major Ian Thomas affirms you.
(Jennifer) Well, and that, it’s really quite shocking to me, because on a level that I can barely even access, I am in with both feet. That does not mean that my every day is, “Oh, Lord, whatever You would have, whatever You would do, tra-la-la. Love, love, love always and forever.” No, that is not the relationship. I mean, I’m a fish wife, you know what I mean? And that’s in terms of how I deal with Him. Here’s something that Martha told me, and I think it’s been so incredibly freeing in my relationship with Him, and it sets such a standard. And Martha, first of all she said, “It’s ridiculous not to tell the Lord what’s in your heart, because He knows anyway. So, it’s a sham to try and keep something from Him.” And you did. I don’t remember what… I was crying uncontrollably about once again, I was, you know, on my face, and I’d messed up and, you know, I’d failed the test… blah, blah, blah. Pick it. I don’t even remember what I was boohooing about, because that doesn’t matter. But you said, “All you have to give Him ever is your failure, your wickedness, your wretchedness, your unlovingness, your meanness. This is all you will ever have to give Him; your flesh. That’s all you have to offer God; your dark heart. He takes care of… He has to give you the heart of flesh, because all you can do is give Him your heart of stone.” And I can’t tell you what that did for me. I don’t love Him enough, and so I keep asking for it, and that’s fine, but I love Him enough that I did not want that to be what I gave Him. And it was kind of devastating that that’s all I had to give Him; the worst of me, which was all of me. You know, and that the way you put it made it sound like it’s all He wanted from me, all He expected. But that for Him it was, “Thank you. Now, here’s this.” Do you know what I mean, that it wasn’t a “ehhh, dirty.” It wasn’t, it wasn’t what I thought it was. It wasn’t the shameful thing. It was His joy, because the more that was wicked of me that I gave Him, the more He had of Himself to give me. And the more relationship there was, the more joy there was clean, being clean. And, you know, that has set… It just changed, it changed how I approached Him on every level, and it allowed me say things to Him that I never thought I would talk to God about. That’s the truth. Because I thought, well, instead of keeping it in here being ashamed of it, Martha says I give it You, and then You take care of it. So, it was a way of, to me, that’s what true confession is, to take that to Him. And literally, you’re not just telling something, you’re giving it to Him, saying, “This is all I’ve got.”
(M) I’d wanted to share this with you all anyway, but one of my great frustrations in life is the issue of time. And for many years, I think from, even from my childhood probably on in, I have felt that I had to live in a frenzy of hurry. And I have prayed thousands of times over that, and I have said, “This is unbelief.” I don’t believe there is enough time for all You’ve given me to do. And so I have to hurry. And it’s been bad for John, because he’s not in a hurry, and I always am, and I always think time is a crisis. And I have tried my best to put it to death, to put it to the grave. And I don’t know what has happened to me. I don’t know how He did it. He sneaks in and changes you, and suddenly he went, “Where’d you come from? I don’t know you.” He has put me in a timelessness, where there’s no hurry, and he did it through a funny little saying I just stumbled across, and I think it was from a movie, “Slowness is the essence of happiness.” It wasn’t Christian. But, “Slowness is the essence of happiness.” And I went, “Oh, that is really true.” But somehow He used that as a catalyst, but He’s changed me so that I’m not feeling that pressure that I’ve always felt from childhood that… And Jacquelyn would insult it by saying, “I’m late, I’m late for a very important date, so no time to say hello, goodbye, I’m late, I’m late, I’m late,” from Alice in Wonderland. And I would stick out my tongue at her, but she was… because I knew she was right. That was how I lived. “I’m late, I’m late, I’m late for a very important date. No time to say hello, goodbye, I’m late.” And I don’t know why that wasn’t solved sooner. I have no idea, but all I know is, I understand where we live in the heavenly realm, which is really what I want to talk about is the heavenly realm. In the heavenly realm, we live in a timeless place, and I’m somehow there. May I stay there by His grace. Yesterday I met with someone, and it was leisure. And she said to me, “I love this. We can just sit and get to know each other.” And I said, “In leisure.” She didn’t know what I meant by “In leisure.” Wow, I can be here in leisure? So that’s this transformation, to make you who you’re not. And that’s the process. The process is for you to become who you already are, but don’t know you are, and have never seen who you are. But He makes you become who you are that’s always been. But the process! I will not… Your blog, your creation of “Get Along with God,” was to validate the process…
(J and Jennifer) Yes, umhmmm.
(M) Of coming to know Him, but much more coming into what He has already accomplished on the cross. And I will not admit a doctrine that doesn’t acknowledge what the New Testament itself acknowledges, that there is a process of dying daily. I’m fighting against that new religion that is a lie that makes you think… It’s a delusion. It propels you into a delusion. And I heard someone I really respected many years ago. He said, “Whatever you do is holy. You brush your teeth. It’s a holy act.” And I went, “My spirit does not resonate with that,” and I didn’t know why. So I really could not receive that teaching, that everything I did was holy. And it took me years to understand why my spirit said, “UhUh, that’s not the truth.” What my flesh does is vile. What my spirit does, what Christ does in me is holy. There are two different realms.
(J) That’s what I said, “Whatever Christ does in me is eternal, but whatever I do, it’s…
(M) It’s death.
(J) Death.”
Amazing light. There are a lot of things going on out there that do not “resonate” in the Spirit, as Martha puts it. A bunch of lies in the name of God. I loved Jennifer’s words of insight too:
You have the relationship with God that you have chosen, so if your life is kind of dead, if you don’t hear Him, if He’s not there, that’s because you chose that. Now, that doesn’t account for times when we’re in the wilderness and there are these things certainly. It’s not a blanket. I’m not proclaiming judgment on anybody, but we have the choice.
His Life is the ever “dark” way of faith… “dark” to the “flesh” (life of the soul, soulish life), but an ever increasing light to the spirit. The “darkness of faith” IS an on-going discipline for us, and the means His kingdom is established and set up in our land. He really meant His way was like that when He said this:
“But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye should speak, for it will be given you in that hour what ye will speak”.
Is there anything more “obscure” and “hidden” (from ourselves!) than that?
Now, I say this because that word of “whatever you do is holy”, has to do with self-awareness. Everything belonging to the flesh has to do with self-awareness. but Jesus did not say this. He said we are to give up control, and our “awareness” comes from the Spirit of Understanding and Revelation. He is our “awareness” and the risen Life in which we dwell.
It is really simple to follow Him. Everything that belongs to flesh ends up serving self (ambition).
The “everything you do is holy” idea is a self-awareness self-serving thing. Holiness that comes from God DOES NOT serve “me”. It goes back to Him in raw adoration at the very second.
That’s why it says this: You shall make a plate of pure gold, and engrave on it, like the engravings of a signet, ‘HOLY TO YAHWEH.’ Ex. 28:36
Holiness IS from Him and for Him!
Dearest Jennifer, it is truly devastating to discover that we have nothing good to offer Him. But also, like you know, on some level remarkable…a miracle really, because it somehow lifts the veil to see Him clearer.
Dearest Martha, I believe in the physical reality of Ezekiel’s visions of the “wheels within the wheels” and I believe He is letting us live in that. And while we cannot always accurately describe with words, we know in our spirits we are living in a nother time zone! How wonderful is our heritage in Christ!
Dearest John, I have been made aware over some years that our life with Him is hidden. Covert, not overt. I always think of Song of Songs and the Book of Esther, where His name IS HIDDEN in the text.
Thank you all, “for I have derived great joy and comfort and encouragement from your love, because the hearts of the saints have been cheered and refreshed through you…” – Philemon 7
Thank you, Martha, for speaking those words to Jennifer and, Jennifer, for blessing us with them. I’ve never heard anything like that: “give Him your failures, your wretchedness…” so He can give you more of Himself — and that, it is even His joy!! How amazing is that?! More people than just me need to hear this . . . there seems to be an unspoken belief in a lot of ‘churches’ (mine included), that you just need to clean your act up, then you’re ‘fit’ to worship; then He’ll hear your prayers, etc. What freedom this is! I cried with you, Jennifer.
“I’m late…” Martha, this reminded me of one of your tapes (yes, that long ago) where you said that Jesus was never in a hurry. Then you affirmed this by quoting Isaiah: “He will not cry or shout aloud or cause His voice to be heard in the street. A bruised reed He shall not break, and a smoking wick He shall not quench.”
That got burned into my spirit whenever I was tempted to rush at work–despite being micromanaged: how many cases we researched and resolved, down to the number of keystrokes that were being counted (not kidding!). And when He caused me to slow down, give it to Him, more work got done, not less.
“Am I going to be affected by His cross” – John, painfully, powerful statement!
I thank God for you all.
As I listened to your heart Jennifer, I heard…”Then sings my soul…” Your flayed open candor is not only an encouragement but also a challenge. I love you!
I needed to hear your testimony about being in a hurry Martha. For several years I’ve been blessed with NO demands on my time. Many of those days have been spent sitting uninterrupted at His feet for as long as my heart desired. I had become terribly spoiled. I began a new job two weeks ago. I had totally forgotten what it meant to be in a state of hurry. It seems as of late when I find time to breathe I notice I’ve been holding my breath. This is not His best. If I’d never experienced the peace and calm of no hurry I might have missed the possibility of it. I know it’s available…always available. It’s just up to me to availe myself to it. Bless you for reminding me.
“It’s the difference between…the daughters of Jerusalem and the Shulamite and the Bride.” Just to be His Bride…this alone is my greatest desire. As difficult as it is sometimes to be obedient I’m not willing to ignore His instruction. He knows the truth of what is best for me. I pray that I will not jeopardize that opportunity by relegating Him to the outside only. It’s just plain hard sometimes…it’s heart breaking other times. But I have learned He is the healer of all things broken if they’re just taken to Him.
It is my prayer that as others listen their hearts will be pierced by the truth of this message as mine is.