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with Martha Kilpatrick and John Enslow
(M) But I’ll be bold to say there are false prophets making false signs and false experiences that claim to be glory, which are not. Beware church. We are responsible for what we allow to deceive us. We are responsible for wanting experience of the flesh and an emotional high. We are a people ripe for that because we want feelings. But if you wait for God, Himself, the feelings are beyond human.
(J) The times that I’ve seen it, there wasn’t anything about the feelings, though there were feelings involved, it wasn’t about the feelings at all.
(M) That’s true, that’s true. You aren’t even aware of what you feel until later. But in doing this message, and searching the scriptures and remembering, it’s just been a time, as it was for you. Before I did the message I spent all day remembering all the experiences of glory. I forgot about the one in Syracuse where the glow came. I had not included that because for me that was not an experience. I would have never known it happened if you and others hadn’t told me.
(J) It was amazing.
(M) Hmm. You did the cover of that series… You found a picture that looked like…
(J) Yeah, I did, I got a picture that looked just like what you looked like. And it was from the…what was it? Was it “The Heaven’s Rule” series? I think it’s what it is. It’s a blue series, and then that’s what you looked like.
(M) I wasn’t, (Martha laughs) I didn’t see it. But I’ve been just, just considering all the memories of His glory. And many, many occasions when it was just a matter of His Presence reducing me to tears, and to worship on the floor. And a dear, dear friend said, “Martha what is the glory?” She said, “ I’ve been struck to the floor in worship.” And I said that is the glory. That is it. It’s when the Spirit moves so upon you to worship the Father, and ah, so. But I want to experience the glory, all that I’m allowed to in this life. And I want everybody to have that experience in one form or another.
(J) But what’s Paul say? “My determined purpose is to know…” And that’s really what the glory’s for, is that we would know (Martha responds with ‘awuuu’) and see… I mean He’s revealing Himself so that we would know Him. And isn’t that the way the scripture says, the determined purpose is to know?
(M) It’s to know Him intimately.
(J) More intimately. And when the glory comes there is a sense of knowing, a deep sense of knowing His holiness and His righteousness and His bigness.
(M) That’s right. And it seems to me that the glory comes in different aspects. There’s no two occasions that it was alike.
(J0 It was completely different every time.
(M) And so, it is a revealing of Him in different ways. The one, the first experience I had I didn’t know it was the glory until later. I just thought it was the Presence of God. And I felt like if I could just cross one thin thread of a line I could see into the heavens. I never did, but I felt like I was… It wasn’t that He came down to me; it was that He took me up; and I didn’t see or hear anything particularly, but it was… Other times He comes…, it’s the glory comes down to you, but sometimes He takes you up to the glory. But may we be hungry for it, for Him, to know Him.
(J) That’s the hunger, to know Him.
(M) And it’s… He wants to give us a great spiritual adventure of Himself. He wants to. This is not a boring walk. (Martha laughs)
(J) I thought it was before I entered it. (Martha laughs)
(M) Well, I’m glad you wanted to discuss it further.
(J) I wouldn’t have interrupted you during the message if I didn’t think… all of a sudden I start pulling it out saying, “ok, let’s talk.”
(M) (Martha laughs) Well, it’s been fun, and it awakens in me a real, a real desire to see and know and experience and witness Him in His glory, and to release the glory that dwells in me. It says… Jesus said, “I have given them the glory You gave me,”… past tense.
(J) And then you wonder why, why are people not more experiencing it and seeing it? I’m not putting you on the spot, I’m just…
(M) Well, I’m thinking of the person that introduced me to the subject, and then I experienced the glory, and I told her about it. She said that was the glory. And she asked God. She wasn’t jealous, but she was desirous, so she asked God, “Why do you not give it to me?” And He said, “You’re not able, you’re not ready.” Now what that means, I don’t know. Here’s the scripture I mentioned I think in the tape, but I did not… I mentioned the New Jerusalem being the glory, but I did not quote the scripture. Here it is, ‘a city’, it’s Rev. 21, the end of the book is about the glory of God. “The city has no need of sun or moon to shine on it for the glory of God gives it light, and it’s lamp is the Lamb.” Oh, ok, verse 24; “By it’s light will the nations walk, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it.” I do know that means believers, not governors. God recognizes that He has made us priests and kings. So I’ll leave with that. That’s the end of our journey. The end of the human experience will be the New Jerusalem in all its glory. And the glory will be so visible then. And how we’ll bear it I don’t know, except we’ll be new; new creations in resurrected bodies. So, I just figure I’ll weep forever, because that’s what I do when the, when the glory comes… just cry.