With Martha Kilpatrick and hosted by John Enslow
(J) Ok well, Martha, this morning we’re continuing on the whole theme of rejection. And we’re taking it in a little different viewpoint, and I’m real excited about it. I think this is a real key to my life as well as a number of people’s lives. And so, how would you like to introduce this?
(M) Well, I hope I can get through it without weeping. But I think you’ve come up this morning, and I think the Lord has shown you exactly what we do with God. And if you remember Carole’s podcast she said when she was dealing with rejection that she began to pray and to say, I want to be sure who I’m talking to, the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ. And that was her break-through; she went to the real God. So what you’ve gotten this morning is just such an explanation of what we do. And my whole book about Cain and Able is that sin is really thinking you’re God. And we don’t really ‘get that’, that that’s what we do. So this morning you’ve given me just reams of your insight, and I’v tried to copy it down because it is so phenomenal. So you start, and I’ll cry.
(J) Well, we’ve been dealing with that aspect of rejection and dealing with God, but I, I’ve been really kind of focused on rejection for quite awhile now. I’ve just been…every morning now I’m just going back to looking at different aspects of rejection. And…
(M) We’ve been dealing with the stronghold of rejection, but you’re going a different route this morning.
(J) I’ve just been going around and around the airport, kind of circling the airport looking at different aspects of rejection, and what rejection means. And I just feel like I have some real light on rejection. And today in particular, I’m talking about the rejection of not hearing the Voice. Ok, we are our voice; andI mean, we are expressed by our voice; by our actions and our voice. And if I am dealing with you, or if I am dealing with anyone, and not hearing your voice, I’m really not dealing ‘with you’. And so I’ve seen that we can go to God in the morning, in a quiet time and totally not be going to God, because we’re not hearing Him. I have to go to Him according to every word He says about me, and about my situation. And if I go to it with some past pre-conceived notion, if I go with some past hurt, some past woundedness, something in the past, and I drag that in, and I believe that He’s saying something that He’s not saying because I’m not listening to Him? I’m really not having a relationship with Him. I have to hear a person, in order to have a relationship with a person. Amazing.
(M) (Laughter) Basic; but brilliant.
(J) Well I mean it, I cannot tell you how many people I know, go to God and ‘hear’ parental issues, they hear ah, whatever. The list is probably endless. But I’ve just realized that you have to go with an open ear. “He who hears My Voice.” You have to listen to what He’s saying. And if you go with a preconceived, predisposed thought of what He’s going to say, you’re not… you can’t hear Him. And uhmm…
(M) And so you can’t be healed or transformed or directed or changed or illumined, unless you hear the real God.
(J) Not at all. And it’s, it’s the ultimate transference. And as I was driving over here, God said it has everything to do with bitterness and unforgiveness. Because what you’re doing is, if you had forgiven, if you are current to the day, if you are current, then you wouldn’t be transferring an identity that’s not yours.
(J) So, I can say it this way, if I come to you, and I’m having a conversation with you, and everything you’re saying to me I’m hearing something totally different; I’m hearing rejection, or I’m hearing whatever. But I’m not listening to you. It doesn’t matter what you say, because I’m having a totally different relationship. You might as well be a cardboard person because I’m not hearing you. I’m hearing…
(M) Your idea of what I’m saying.
(J) Yes. And in doing that, in doing the false hearing, I’m not letting you be you; I’m not hearing you. This is so powerful to me, but it’s not coming out as powerful as it is.
(M) Just keep going, because it is revolutionary. It is the answer. It’s… You said this morning, I tried to type all that you said, but “if you don’t let God be who He is, and feel what He feels, you are rejecting God.”
(J) Ok, so I can go in that whole realm now, take it out of person to person, and take it to God. If I don’t allow God to be who He is, and say what He wants to say, and define what He wants to define, then I am rejecting Him. And this is… We’re seeing that a number of people will literally make a persona of acceptance in order not to be rejected. But by doing that you’re rejecting God, because you’re not allowing Him to speak.
(M) I can give you an illustration of that, because I thought about it this morning. I had someone years ago that I was working with, and she was deeply, terrible religious, and really very, very messed up. And I kept going to these issues with her. And we would go to worship together and she would just weep, and I would say oh, what is God saying? She would say He says He loves me. Well He did, He does love her, but that’s not what He was saying.
(M) And I knew it. How do you tell somebody no, He’s not telling you that? You can’t.
(M) But I knew that she was not really hearing the true God.
(M) And that ultimately she was rejecting the diagnosis of God through me. And at the end John she crashed completely, in every way, morally, spiritually, because she would not listen to me, and because she would not listen to the true God. She made Him be a lover that she wanted Him to be. But she would not go the way you have to go to know Him as lover, which is to die, and to be accountable and to be repentant. So that’s the living illustration I can give you of what you’re talking about. The end is death. It was the death of her whole mission, ministry, marriage, family, herself. The end of creating your own god is that you die, because you’re not getting Life!
(J) Well, we will be accepted, because we are accepted. But if we try to make ourself accepted by petting our self… And I can only deal with God, and I can only deal with people, as they are, and what they say, their voice. I can only deal with that. If I bring in anything… And what I saw was, is that it deals with, it’s unforgiveness. You have to have a clean slate. You have to have a clean slate every day, with every person, or you will bring other issues, other situations into that relationship, and cloud the Voice. And so, I can’t tell you how many years, have mercy, how many years I have had my hearing clouded by unforgiveness, bitterness, bitter-root judgment, and just undealt with… I usually… I tend to stuff things. I will say, I forgive, but I choose to more put it into someplace that I don’t want to look at… rather than dealing with it. And in doing that over and over and over, I’ve just, I mean my trunk is full; it’s bulging. And now it’s spewing out. And it’s clouded my hearing of God. And so when I go to Him, I hear something totally different. I can’t hear His Voice for today. And today I sat there and I said, “I just come to You.” I mean I’ve been on this for a while now. And I just sat there and I was listening. And I heard some… It’s not even like I heard words. I just, I just knew, it was like in me I went oh wow, this is real different. And ah, so I’m pretty amazed; because see what I’ve done with my rejection of God, the God who created me… ah, He… I believed in His rejection and I rejected myself, and so it was this big huge pile. I mean it was just a mess, pile, dung-heap; I just kept on heaping it on it. And, and really, I’ve had the chastening of God because of my rejection of self. But I’m seeing why He has had to chasten me, because I was deaf and I was blinded by rejection because I believed in His rejection. When I went to Him I believed in His rejection over His acceptance. Now I’m not saying that I have to go and say oh God loves me like that woman did; oh He’s just… I’m not about ‘petting myself’ here, and letting my idea of God… No, I have to let Him say what He wants to say. I have to believe what He says in the Word. But not only do I have to believe what He says in the Word, I have to let Him speak what He wants to say. And if it is correction or chastisement, I have to say this is what You say about me, this is what You say about Your children. So this is how this is coming, and I can’t define it. I’ve got to let Him be Him, just like I have got to be me in my dealings with people, and people have got to be themselves in their dealing with me, God’s got to be Himself. You wrote down what I said today. “When people go to God and define who He is or what He thinks, we are telling Him who He is going to be, and we are rejecting Him because we won’t let Him ‘be’.” And see, when I was looking at that whole thing, the Great I Am, ‘I Am’, which means ‘to be’. In Hebrew it means to be. So He’s saying ‘I will be who I will be’, I won’t be defined by who you think I am, I am who I am. And so I can’t go to Him and define Him, or I’m not having a relationship with Him. I can’t come to you and define you. Now granted, we are human, and we are stupid sheep, and it’s a work to do that. But the way we do that is staying current, and staying clean, and keeping my dealings with you, with ‘you’. And letting you say what you say, and me… but if I harbor things, and you say things to me and I harbor them and let them sit and fester? You know, I’m either going to spew it back on you, I’m going to spew it on God, or I’m going to spew it on someone else. And so, it’s living in truth. It’s living in reality and truth. To me, this is amazing because it’s just another aspect of rejection and how rejection is so detrimental to everyone around you. It literally is a time bomb waiting to go off.