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Practical Life and Super Spiritual People
Episode #493
May 15, 2016
With Martha Kilpatrick and hosted by John Enslow
Special Guest: Carole Nelson and Jennifer Wentzel
This is the continuation of a series of Podcasts started in Episode #490.
(J) Well, that’s what gives me personally a real heart for the tragedy. It’s tragic, because you’re talking about people that are locked in and don’t know how to get out. They’re bound. For it to be that tragic, that’s heinous. She was a woman that you loved, I loved, we loved, who was caught. And she knew.
(Martha) And you had the most precious vision. I don’t think she would mind if we tell it. But you had a vision of her years ago of God holding His arms tightly around a hysterical child, and He was going to hold her until she could calm down, however long that took. Is that the correct?
(J) It was to wear her out.
(Martha) To wear her out.
(J) She literally was hysterical, and she was flailing, and He just said, “I’ll hold you as long as I need to, until you are completely worn out.”
(Martha) Oh, my goodness.
(J) And that was, but it was a tragedy. There was a tragedy in it. And there was a rescuing. But what we said while you weren’t here is that the super spiritual are renegades. Renegades. Rebels. They’re renegades and they’re independent, as Carole said. There’s an independence and a renegadeness that makes them frightening. And one of the things that she said is, Carole said about the authority, she said when she came underneath authority, yeah, you did love, I loved. But when she came underneath, God literally established an authority so that she had – and a love – so that she had the permission to come out, and the way to come out. If she had never submitted to the authority, I don’t believe she ever would have come out. And the reason why she wouldn’t have is because the super spiritual are renegades. You are not under the authority of God if you are super spiritual, because you are doing a form of godliness without the power, which comes from His life.
(Carole) Super spiritual people are right. They believe they’re right, and they believe, really, that everybody else is wrong. And gosh, that could be exploded. I see the explosion of it. And that makes them, right there, that choice to be right, makes them absolutely independent and unreachable, unless that person comes to a place. God brought me to a place where, I mean He terrified me, He really terrified me, meaning He saw it was a choice of life and death, literally life, heaven or hell. Life or death. I have never been hung over hell as such, but that was a place of knowing, knowing.
(Martha) You knew it.
(Carole) I knew it. I knew it was life or death, heaven or hell, and that scared the bejabbers out of me. Really, it scared me more than my fear and my staying where I was. But, yeah, I really believe the super spiritual are rebels. They’re independent, and they’re independent because they believe they are right. And they believe they already know. And there may be a pretense of humility and a slight degree of acquiescence to what someone else says or someone else believes or whatever, but in truth they believe they already know.
(Martha) Really, really they believe.
(Carole) I believe there is a level, yeah, they’re totally unteachable.
(J) Umhmm.
(Jennifer) And I can relate, ok, in terms of the rebel, the rebellion, the refusing to come under authority. That’s, you know, that’s not been a small thing in my life. Still is not a small thing in my life. And the fear of God, to me, must come and dethrone me. You can get caught in that. You do it. You make the choice, and then you can’t get off the throne. That’s, to me, and that’s almost, it’s almost as… maybe it’s worse a prison than when you can’t get out of the pit. You know, you’re either on the throne or you’re in a pit, one of the other. And sometimes both. Maybe your throne’s in the pit, or it’s just that dirty. But the fear of God comes and dethrones you. That’s being hung over hell, because all of a sudden you’re not on the throne. You haven’t got the scepter, and your delusion that there is such a thing as you sitting across the way from the Almighty saying, “I will not. You can’t say…,” as if you are equals. Tell me you’re not on a throne. If you’re equal to God, you’ve got a throne. He’s God. But the being right thing, I think that ties into the throne. If you’re God, then of course you know everything. It’s your interpretation of what it is, your morality in a way. And I think that’s the other reason that this CD of the Month is so necessary. And it’s such love, because they’re not the only ones who will be held accountable.
(Martha) Umhmm.
(Jennifer) And you’re absolutely right, Martha, when you said this is the call of the last days to the church. It’s what you said in there. And I thought, “You know what? That’s exactly it.” I can’t run screaming away from these people, because I want nothing to do with them, because I find them morally repugnant, because the spirit that’s sitting on them is such the antithesis of anything I will consider godly. I don’t have that option. I don’t have that right, and I don’t have that option. What was it? You told the story years ago, and it’s in one of the booklets and several of your teachings, Martha, where you said God told you to speak and you saw the woman in a dream before God and she was being held accountable, and she turned back and looked at you and said, “Why didn’t you tell me?” And the whole, the blood on your hands and all the rest of it. There’s so much that is blooming in the way of evil and it’s because we don’t love enough to fight it. I mean, that’s really, for me, my prayer right now is I see how I do not love enough, not enough. And so, it has become… And I’ve kind of taken it – I don’t really like the word mantra, because I think it has a little bit of kind of a kum-by-ya, Zen kind of feeling. But it is a form of meditation, if you will take it. And I found myself going through the day, and instead of saying, “You will love the Lord, your God, with all you heart, with all your soul, with all your mind.” What did I miss? Mind?
(J) Strength.
(Jennifer) Strength. I put, “I.” So, I made it my declaration through the day, and I’ve been doing that for a week now. And I have to say, it’s partly for this purpose, because if it doesn’t become second nature, if it doesn’t become something I move into that I, by my choice, have opened the door as wide opened to Him as it can possibly be, there is no way that I will have the love that will be necessary to confront as Jesus Christ in me would have that confrontation, that correction, that discipline, that truth coming in, in anyway that would be received by somebody who’s caught in that, like my distant relative. You know. And that’s the truth. That’s the thing. It’s very personal. This isn’t, “Hey, you, out there,” or so and so down the street. Is this not, this is a personal thing for every single person. If you are in the Body of Christ, is this not personal for you? Will you not be held accountable for what you did or did not say, same as them? Wow, now I’ve gone off the deep end a little bit.
(Martha) But, Jennifer, the wonderful thing about it, this challenge, this facing all of it, is if you enter obedience for the sake of somebody that messed up, I’ll say, God is so faithful. And if it’s time for you to leave, He’ll take you out. He doesn’t just throw you to the wolves and watch you be shredded. He will undertake every step of it and undertake the love. The comfort is that His will will reign, and it will protect you. And to enter it is far less dangerous than to fail to obey.
Yes Sandy… it is a scary thing for you and a scary way of living for the one acting it out. You hit the pan, as did the others. Martha is right: God takes care of religious people as much as he takes care of sinners: solution is death… the all-incompassing death of Jesus!
Martha said something really good here: “if you enter obedience for the sake of somebody that messed up…” The point is that before you can help other, you have to help yourself putting yourself under obedience. That’s VITAL… and that’s the reality of the Body functioning, and there’s no other.
Thank you for the revamped site. I cannot imagine how much that took!
God bless your work in the abundance of Christ,
Sam
…to say that I “enjoyed” today’s podcast would be a wierd way to put it! This whole super spiritual talk is “scary”(I can’t think of another way to put it).
It’s fearsome…
Both ways, like Jennifer said…
But wow! Everything looks very nice around here! I like what you did to the place!